Nerf GW boss!

Nerf GW boss!

Postby popo » Sat Sep 27, 2014 8:55 pm

Dear PM,

I understand that when powerful new cards enter the game (Panzer, Horsemen, esp. Dragon Queen), modifications must be made: e.g. Hell dungeons should not be farmable without hundreds of revives, etc. In particular, one thing I've noticed is that there should not exist a strategy that can defeat a GW boss 100% of the time without revives. However, must this reshuffling occur midstream? I.e. the new GW boss appears to have been precisely engineered so that uberpowerful combos like

Light Dragon Queen leader/coleader - Light panzer - Faith - 2x 8* Light Dragon

cannot reliably beat the boss. This is an understandable goal, but it seems you're throwing the baby out with the bathwater if it means the boss is flat impossible for any deck without DQ leader/coleader.

When I examined the formula determining dmg output by turn, it is overwhelmingly obvious that it was designed with very powerful decks in mind. CD, ICD, initial damage, and damage progression were clearly tailored to require luck/revives to defeat the boss. With all this care taken, it seems difficult to believe that the following were ignored:

1) Oath x2 mono decks with horseman cannot make it to turn 11 - i.e. can only use half of one Horseman skill.
2) Any lock deck using Zeus is flat-out unusable - a team using 5 (!) maxed (!) nullifiers still needs luck.
3) The reward curve and total HP are ridiculous - the old standby of "Marionette + Shooters" would require enormous luck to make it to turn 30, only to discover that 200k damage is only worth 400 guild points.

Who is going to compete for this card? The only decks that aren't laughably unusable require a pre-existing dragon queen, as well as huge amounts of time and a ridiculous tradeoff - a dozen revives for each run or a huge stack of gems so you don't need to. How many of these players are there?

It seems like PM is leaving a lot of $ on the table here. I'm sure there are lots of players (myself included) who think spending $30 or even $50 for such a card is not out of the question. But $200? Really?

I understand that managing all the dynamics in such a game is very difficult. But it seems like the dev team spent so much time on the margins (what about a full team of maxed 8* dragons?) that they all got tired and the result is probably worse than if they'd left it alone. I'd be very depressed if somebody thought for longer than 5 minutes and then came up with this.
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby admin » Sat Sep 27, 2014 9:13 pm

I have actually talked to the design team regarding this already and the current boss was actually already nerfed down before it was released. The Dragon Queen GW boss series are indeed intentionally designed to be harder than the previous set, as the boss card is much more useful compared the previous set.

The first two Dragon Queens was also actually released with lower attacks than intended, so players are given a chance to work toward obtaining one of the queen cards.

I will continue to pass feedback to the design team, however I don't expect boss to be lowered any further. If the result of this war indeed show the boss was too powerful, then they may nerf the next GW boss further.
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby TitusK » Sat Sep 27, 2014 9:17 pm

I like the new bosses, the old ones were easily defeated with a dual reaper team. New bosses making reaper almost useless but hey, at least it's a little more of a challenge.
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby Delete » Sat Sep 27, 2014 9:21 pm

Will these bosses be rotated again in the future with the easier bosses again for newer players like me? every time i feel like I get a bit stronger and can progress i find myself still behind the increasing difficulty curve. It's a bit demoralizing.
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby admin » Sat Sep 27, 2014 9:23 pm

Delete wrote:Will these bosses be rotated again in the future with the easier bosses again for newer players like me? every time i feel like I get a bit stronger and can progress i find myself still behind the increasing difficulty curve. It's a bit demoralizing.


While it hasn't been 100% determined yet, but they are likely to cycle once like the last set. Please don't quote me on that if the plan changes however.
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby chris71483 » Sat Sep 27, 2014 10:19 pm

I do agree that this one is hard. There is 0 cool down in this thing making it hard to get cards on my deck to even use their skills and I did all your combos. I'm not going to waste Hundreds of $$$ on this one card lol.
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby Carava » Sat Sep 27, 2014 10:47 pm

i got my first zeus on like the 3rd day of the last guild war and had fun with it(yay 23 turns) :) doesnt work on this one :(
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby ferg » Sat Sep 27, 2014 11:14 pm

Delete wrote:every time i feel like I get a bit stronger and can progress i find myself still behind the increasing difficulty curve. It's a bit demoralizing.


Agreed, I had 2 teams geared up for this war. One is completely useless and the other one is almost useless.

I'll save my gems until the last day and see where I stand. If I use them now, I might be throwing them away.
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby Ragnarok72 » Sun Sep 28, 2014 2:22 am

Was probably tested with some max skilled panzers guys, design team tends to forget those cards aren't so common :p
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Re: Nerf GW boss!

Postby HernHunter » Sun Sep 28, 2014 2:26 am

TitusK wrote:I like the new bosses, the old ones were easily defeated with a dual reaper team. New bosses making reaper almost useless but hey, at least it's a little more of a challenge.

Are you sure about what you write about double reaper team?? :mrgreen:

Returning to main topic. I understand that better cards must be harder to obtain, but i can feel that each new GW Boss is much stronger. I wonder how did they work in after design & before lowering of their power? As it was talked before, in my opinion design team is creating new maps & GW bosses against players with panzers & think they use maxed panzers, but it is wrong way. We was talking about it in prewious topic: viewtopic.php?f=36&t=13740. All
conclusions writen there about Forest map works here too. Remember this game is not made "against players", but for their fun. If you create bosses too strong to be beaten what kind of satisfaction you get from that?
Last edited by HernHunter on Sun Sep 28, 2014 2:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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